Is English Grammar learnable past the 'Grammar Stage?'

[A Priori]

Hi all. I'm new to forum, and I come with a very specific question in mind.

I'd like to learn Latin at some point in the (not so distant) future, but I know that my knowledge of English grammar is waaaaay below par to even attempt to plow through Wheelock, et al. You see, I'm an 18-year-old high school 'graduate' who was never taught any English grammar beyond the parts of speech and a few other very simple concepts back in elementary school. Diagramming sentences is completely foreign to me, and I didn't learn what a 'direct object' was until my freshman year of high school. I'd like to at least try to remedy my ignorance in this area.

So...

Does anybody know of any good grammar texts geared toward the inherently slower mind of the post-adolescent? More generally, do you think it's actually possible for someone my age to even learn English grammar, or should I redirect my efforts to other, more doable subjects?

Thanks for your time.

[Mungo]

More generally, do you think it's actually possible for someone my age to even learn English grammar, or should I redirect my efforts to other, more doable subjects?

Of course it's possible! I didn't have any systematic instruction in English grammar until I took a course in copyediting in my mid-20s - and that was after completing a doctorate.

Three books that might help you are:

* Warriner's English Composition and Grammar: Complete Course
* Our Mother Tongue by Nancy Wilson (canonpress.org)
* English Grammar for Students of Latin

Good luck!

[JasonAlexander]

A Priori,
go take this grammar fitness course with the Barnes and Nobles free university and then come right back and learn a Latin centered classical education with us!

http://educate.barnesandnoble.com/educate/bn/home/catalog/overview.jsp?productId=6324&z=y&nhid=bn


also you can do as i'm doing and start off with Prima Latina and work thru, i'm really getting an exellent grammar review, and learning alot of Latin, plus it's fun because it was geared for young children.
Jay

[Maria]

A Priori,

More generally, do you think it's actually possible for someone my age to even learn English grammar, or should I redirect my efforts to other, more doable subjects?
At 18?! Hey, you're young; I'm 20! :D Well, I was home schooled and so had the opportunity to teach myself. I'm not in college now, but I'm still studying.

Does anybody know of any good grammar texts geared toward the inherently slower mind of the post-adolescent?
I too learned hardly any English grammar before high school, but in ninth grade I used Warriner's English Grammar and Composition: Third Course (which is a ninth grade textbook). I thought it was a great book. But the grammar concepts didn't really get cemented in my mind until 1) I took up Latin, and 2) went through grammar a second time in Warriner's English Grammar and Composition: Fourth Course (the tenth grade textbook).

When two of my younger siblings got into high school, I handed them Warriner's series. However, they did not like it at all; they just couldn't digest the grammar the way it was being presented. So I went looking for a different series and came upon Jensen's Grammar (http://jsgrammar.com/mambo/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=shop.flypage&product_id=18&category_id=1&option=com_phpshop&Itemid=38). My siblings loved this book and successfully learned English grammar using it.

Jensen's series is similar to the Saxon Math series in its approach of incremental development and repetitious practice. Warriner's is a more traditional approach. Jensen's does not address sentence diagramming whereas Warriner's does.

So I think a good approach to English grammar using these two series would be first to use Jensen's Grammar to gain a foundation in grammar, and then to use Warriner's English Grammar and Composition: Complete Course to cement the grammar in your mind and to learn any traditional grammar concepts or practices not covered in Jensen's.

Maria

[A Priori]

Three books that might help you are:

* Warriner's English Composition and Grammar: Complete Course

I too learned hardly any English grammar before high school, but in ninth grade I used Warriner's English Grammar and Composition: Third Course (which is a ninth grade textbook). I thought it was a great book. But the grammar concepts didn't really get cemented in my mind until 1) I took up Latin, and 2) went through grammar a second time in Warriner's English Grammar and Composition: Fourth Course (the tenth grade textbook).

Warriner's gets two mentions already? I'm definitely looking into it! From what I can tell, Warriner's uses the diagramming method which, after reading through this awesome site (http://www.geocities.com/gene_moutoux/diagrams.htm), I'm convinced is the way to go. Thanks for the recs!

(More on that site: Apparently, the author has written a grammar textbook that uses sentence diagramming pretty much exclusively. It's quite a bargain at $12.50, and it's designed specifically for older students. I'll look into this more, too.)

So I think a good approach to English grammar using these two series would be first to use Jensen's Grammar to gain a foundation in grammar, and then to use Warriner's English Grammar and Composition: Complete Course to cement the grammar in your mind and to learn any traditional grammar concepts or practices not covered in Jensen's.

That's a very well-thought-out suggestion. I'll definitely consider this exact approach.

go take this grammar fitness course with the Barnes and Nobles free university and then come right back and learn a Latin centered classical education with us!

Thanks for the suggestion, but I just read the course description and it turns out I already know almost everything on the syllabus! Bit of a confidence booster, that.

At 18?! Hey, you're young; I'm 20! Well, I was home schooled and so had the opportunity to teach myself. I'm not in college now, but I'm still studying.

I sometimes wish I would have homeschooled instead. I've always been one of the best students in my class (in fact, I was valedictorian), but I feel as though I've hardly learned anything. I'm now convinced I could have taught myself far more than my high school ever could have. Ah well, no use getting discouraged, as you pointed out.

Of course it's possible! I didn't have any systematic instruction in English grammar until I took a course in copyediting in my mid-20s - and that was after completing a doctorate.

A doctorate in your mid-20's? That's quite impressive!

[Maria]

A Priori,

Originally Posted by Jason Alexander
go take this grammar fitness course with the Barnes and Nobles free university and then come right back and learn a Latin centered classical education with us!


Thanks for the suggestion, but I just read the course description and it turns out I already know almost everything on the syllabus! Bit of a confidence booster, that.
Since that is the case, I don't think you will need the Jensen's Grammar I was recommending; Warriner's English Grammar and Composition: Complete Course will be fine by itself.

Maria