Euthlus turns the guns on his teacher again! (but all in jest this time)

[DRVSVS]

Memoria Press teaches classical education.
The classically educated know dialectic.
Therefore, if Memoria press does not teach dialectic, it is not giving a whole classical education.

Martin Cothran is an excellent, lucid, and engaging writer of textbooks.
Drvsvs needs an excellent, lucid, and engaging textbook on dialectic.
Therefore, Drvsvs needs Martin Cothran to write a textbook on dialectic.

Either dialectic can be taught from a textbook or it cannot.
If it can be taught from a textbook, then those who desire to teach a classical education ought to make a textbook on dialectic. If it cannot be taught from a textbook, then those who wish to classically educate have good reason not to make a textbook on dialectic.

Drvsvs is ignorant of whether dialectic can be taught through a textbook or not.
Those who are ignorant of whether dialectic can be taught through a textbook should be told so.
Therefore, Drvsvs should be told whether dialectic can be taught through a textbook.


At least I'm putting your logic book to good use (and those who put logic books to good use should be praised. Therefore....)!

[martin]

Euthlus,

There are two primary meanings of the word 'dialectic'. The first is the art of inference (the common use of this term). If that is the definition you are using, then we already offer this course in our Traditional Logic programs, since logic (at least in its formal branch) is the art of inference.

If by the word 'dialectic' you mean Socratic, or "question and answer," method of instruction, then there are books that already address this, such as Mortimer Adler's "How to Speak, How to Listen."

Therefore, either we have already published the book you are looking for, or the books is available elsewhere. In either case, you should have what you need.

If you have some other definition of 'dialectic', please let us know what it is, and we will enlighten you further.

Protagoras

[DRVSVS]

I have quite a few Adler books but I've never seen that one before. I'm glad you've told me about it. I was, indeed, referring to the Socratic questioning. I wrote my last message after reading an article on this site on dialectic and didactic approaches to education. It talked about the "ironic" stage and the "maiutic" (sorry if I spelled that wrong) stage of conversations. Does Adler's book address this?

Let Euthlus give his teacher one more run now that we refined the meaning of dialectic to exclude traditional logic...
If Protagoras is basing his argument that he should not write a book on dialectic because of the mere existence other books, then Euthlus submits this: There are many logic books, but Protagoras wrote Traditional Logic I and II, and Material Logic. There may or may not be many books on dialectic. If there are, then (Adler's book aside) Protagoras should still write one based upon his habit of writing his own logic books when there have been others written. If there are not, then Protagoras ought to write one to fulfill the need for a text on dialectic. Either way, Protagoras ought to write a book on dialectic.

[martin]

Euthlus,

Adler does indeed discuss this in his book.

In regard to doing a book on dialectic (or "maieutic" or "Socratic") teaching, here is Protagoras' dilemma:

If Protagoras does not write a book on dialectic, some people will be unhappy (since they would like such a book to be available); if Protagoras does write a book on dialectic, then some people will still be unhappy (since they would like other programs to be available but which wouldn't be available because Protagoras would be working on the book on dialectic rather than the other books that they want).

Either Protagoras does not write a book on dialectic, or he does.

In either case, people will be unhappy.

Protagoras might, however, be able to slip between the horns of this dilemma, since he is working on a book on classical education with Andrew Kern (the author of the article on dialectic that you read), which will have some discussion of this. It should be out next year.

Protagoras